Whenever you consider survival television reveals, you’d be forgiven for fascinated by the likes of Man vs Wild or Bare And Afraid, however the grandfather of these reveals, and others like them, is Survivorman.
Les Stroud, higher referred to as the one and solely “Survivorman” began a brand new period of nature television and survival reveals when the primary episode aired in April 2005, and he’s getting down to begin one other new period in media, although this time in video games.
VR video games, particularly, as he’s teamed up with Cream Productions to convey Survivorman VR: The Descent to life, a PlayStation VR2 title that virtually places you within the starring function of an episode of Survivorman.
PSU received to sit down down with Stroud to speak about this coming title, and what he hopes Survivorman VR: The Descent will do for many who dive into the expertise.
This dialog has been barely edited for readability.
Interview – Les Stroud Talks About Bringing Survival To Your Dwelling Room As soon as Once more With Survivorman VR: The Descent
PSU: Firstly, thanks a lot for taking the time to speak as we speak, I really feel inclined to start by saying that I’m an enormous fan. I received flashbacks to watching your present as a child after I was first studying about Survivorman VR: The Descent. Now I’ve been re-watching episodes, watching others for the primary time, and it’s been actually cool to look again on the present.
Stroud:
Nicely you realize, your story is turning into fairly frequent, and splendidly so. There’s so many individuals I meet which can be in all probability roughly round your age and you realize, additionally some who are actually having children of their very own and will likely be saying ‘I watch it with my 5 yr outdated son or daughter.’
And it’s a thrill actually, as a result of I imply, I used to be doing new episodes for 18 years, and there’s an entire era there of people like your self, and it’s nice. I stumble upon individuals on a regular basis that can say, ‘Man I grew up watching your present and it was my solely connection to my Dad’ or this and that. Like it. I completely adore it.
PSU: Talking of outdated episodes, I re-watched the pilot episode and the unique documentary it was primarily based on. Thanks for having all of them up on YouTube, it was nice to look at them and to be fascinated by Survivorman VR now on its approach. How did the concept for Survivorman VR: The Descent come about? Or simply Survivorman VR? With a title like that it sounds to me like there’s going to be extra coming sooner or later.
Stroud:
To begin with, it’s been a thrill to place all my stuff up on YouTube and simply make it free for everyone with all the pieces I’ve ever carried out from Survivorman, Survivorman: Bigfoot, Past Survival, the brand new Wild Harvest sequence that’s on PBS stations within the States and it’s additionally on my YouTube channel.
There’s a lot of stuff – oh and my music, the brand new music I’m doing. I like placing stuff up on YouTube and simply making it free for everyone. However you’re so proper, that connection between the VR and the present, some individuals are gonna return and surprise if he’s received any episodes after which they discover it on YouTube and there’s an entire channel filled with them. It’s fairly cool.
So far as the VR goes, through the years it might make sense, you suppose ‘Why don’t you do a online game?’ you realize, that got here up time and again.
It will be all the pieces from ‘Nicely, right here’s a extremely low cost and ugly technique to do it, or attempt to do it one other approach it’s like a $35 million funds.’ It simply by no means actually clicked, it simply didn’t appear potential.
I can’t launch crap, I can’t launch stuff that isn’t as much as snuff, isn’t as much as high quality. And alongside comes an outdated manufacturing accomplice of mine who was initially there at first days of Survivorman, a gentleman by the title of David Brady who has an organization known as Cream Productions.
We had stayed in contact, at all times speaking about this or that, we’re at all times hatching little mini plans on what we should always do. He mentioned ‘I’ve received this entire wing of Cream Productions that have been actually focusing in on VR.’
They usually’ve carried out it, they’ve carried out some forays into it in another tasks. And I mentioned ‘Nicely, Survivorman is ideal for VR.’ And forgive me however I don’t actually take a look at it like gaming a lot as I take a look at it prefer it’s a simulator in the identical approach that helicopter pilots discover ways to fly a helicopter with a simulator at first, and once we positioned it that approach I believed ‘All proper, I can have enjoyable with this, let’s see the place we are able to go together with this.’
However I used to be very hesitant in that, ‘Nicely let’s simply see the place it goes’ you realize, this might fall flat on its face. Perhaps the manufacturing group isn’t going to do their factor or the know-how isn’t going to work.
So we began there, and that was in all probability virtually three years in the past. Now I imply, this stuff aren’t in a single day builds you realize, they take a very long time, numerous studying alongside the way in which. In order that’s the place we began.
PSU: What would you like individuals to remove from the expertise of Survivorman VR? Would you like individuals to remove precise survival abilities? Do you see this as each an interactive expertise individuals can have but in addition as an academic software?
Stroud:
Completely. I’m the idealist within the background, proper? It’s my face and title and model, all that’s superb, that’s no matter. However ultimately, I solely ever did Survivorman to attach individuals to nature and educate survival abilities.
I solely ever did numerous the opposite issues I’ve carried out for a similar reasoning, similar factor for Survivorman VR. As a result of, you realize I’d go all the way down to the manufacturing group and they’d say ‘Oh we need to do that’ and ‘We need to try this.’
There have been a lot of occasions the place I’d simply say ‘Nicely you possibly can’t try this, that might by no means occur in survival.’ They usually have been so great to work with as a result of they by no means pushed again.
If Les says you possibly can’t try this in survival, we’re not placing it within the sport. So sure, completely I take into account it instructional, but it surely’s additionally part of the gaming group too, so it’s received all that happening.
PSU: Do you consider this as a step in direction of a future the place survival abilities and being extra linked with nature turns into extra prevalent for individuals?
Stroud:
It’s a little bit of a paradox, isn’t it? I do know it’s a stretch for any, say, tree-hugger. It’s like ‘You’re not going to catch me taking part in a sport’ form of factor, however they’re lacking the purpose right here.
Let me return a bit. My entry to nature rising up was watching tv, proper? I’ve watched Jacques Cousteau, I watched Omaha’s Wild Kingdom, and a few Disney reveals. That was it.
But that instilled with me, continues to be inside me, a strong love of nature, that ultimately I used to be in a position to get out in nature myself. So I take a look at it the identical approach, I feel that if there’s a connectedness to nature available, if you happen to’re taking part in Survivorman VR: The Descent, I can think about that even when only one individual is doing that, they usually end and go ‘You already know what, I don’t know why I simply received to go exterior.’
I feel that what’ll occurred, even when they don’t know why, it’s that they’ve been on this factor, studying these abilities, and perhaps I’m being just a little bit naïve or altruistic, I’m undecided, however I feel sure, sure is the quick reply.
I feel it undoubtedly opens up a potential portal, regardless of how skinny it is likely to be for individuals to recollect nature. How about that?
PSU: What was behind the selection to make it an Arctic-based sport, to do the Arctic first?
Stroud:
Nicely that was all Andrew, the designer Andrew Macdonald. I type of let…I’d have gone in a different way, however I’m not the one doing the 12 hours a day in entrance of some mega computer systems.
So it’s like, ‘Nicely what do you need to do?’ proper, and that’s the place he began so I simply didn’t push again. ‘Okay, you’re going to go proper to the Arctic space. Can’t we simply begin in you realize, Higher New York State can be superb?’ Nope, proper to the Arctic.
In order that was actually extra Andrew, that was the place they [Cream Productions] wished to go. So then I turned all of it on their heads and go ‘Okay, however if you happen to’re gonna go there,’ after which I begin correcting and correcting and fixing and holding their ft to the hearth for authenticity.
And I’ll pre-empt one in every of your questions which I’m positive will come on the finish about ‘are there different areas?’ oh man there are 1000 different areas.
PSU: Would beginning in upstate New York have been your first selection if it was as much as you?
Stroud:
Yeah in all probability. I’m nonetheless an teacher in a approach, I’ll by no means not be, I nonetheless geek out on that stuff. If I’m going for a hike or snowshoe hike with my spouse I would go ‘Hey, the place would you make a shelter if you happen to needed to?’ and it’s not like I’m doing survival by myself now, you realize, I don’t have to.
However I’m nonetheless a geek about it. I like beginning small and you realize, begin easy, temperate forest within the summertime or one thing like that. However I feel you realize, I imply Andrew [Macdonald] had some good factors with it.
I imply for one factor, it’s a sport too, so it’s received to be thrilling. Look, suspension of disbelief can be an exquisite factor. You already know, I don’t go full bore, I don’t do actuality tv and I don’t consider in mendacity to my viewers.
However by the identical token, making it thrilling issues. That’s why as Survivorman, I finally went to the Arctic and to the jungles and deserts. So it’s type of only a very thrilling technique to kick issues off.
PSU: You talked about how the concept to make a online game had been tossed your approach earlier than, however that it by no means appeared to make sense. Now that it has with Survivorman VR, was there ever a second alongside the way in which the place you checked in on manufacturing or tried one thing new within the sport and have been actually shocked by the know-how concerned?
Stroud:
Oh sure, completely. In good methods and unhealthy methods. It took me some time to recover from the truth that I used to be dwelling in a dream world, I although it might simply be good. You already know, I’d look good, and it might be, you realize. However I used to be dwelling in a world the place I’m evaluating it to, you realize, the budgets of Marvel Studios.
It’s like, ‘Nicely, if they will make a cartoon look precisely like Robert Downey Jr., why can’t my VR appear like that,’ however I used to be being unrealistic. So it took me awhile to step again and go, ‘Okay, that is nonetheless a piece in progress.’
However Andrew and the group at Cream, they aren’t simply utilizing platforms that exist and making Survivorman VR. They’re inventing platforms and inventing the method as they go and are bettering it continually. And I noticed that.
At first I used to be, ‘You already know, hey, why doesn’t that look higher?’ You already know, after which the subsequent time round, it did. ‘Oh, okay.’ And the subsequent time after that it regarded even higher. So I noticed progress. The place is it going? The skies the restrict now.
Now, as you would possibly know, numerous issues come all the way down to funds, and we’re simply getting going with this. I’ll hope that at some point we now have that type of limitless, you realize, Marvel Studios-size funds, however for now we’re undoubtedly pushing the envelope big with the budgets we now have, and making what I feel is one thing that’s actually highly effective.
The realism in it, so, clearly once more they’re suspending some disbelief, I pop up on display. So it’s me, not solely is it me talking the voice, however once we would report these, any scripting they might do I’d throw out and say I’m gonna do it my approach. So that you’re additionally getting my character, not simply me studying the script that the VR builders suppose I ought to say for that exact second once you come over to the hilltop.
I’m saying, ‘Nicely, I wouldn’t even say that. However right here’s what I’d say.’ I like that. I feel we’re bringing the realism in properly with my very own character shining by as a result of I’m establishing that, ensuring it does. And I can go advert nauseum into the small print of the survival facet of it and the methods I’d push the builders to do it appropriately.
It’s a good distance round answering your query, however I’m very pleasantly stunned. I went from excessive expectations that I had, introduced all the way down to actuality after which they’ve gone proper again up once more.
PSU: After I was trying again at outdated Survivorman episodes, I used to be caught by one thing you mentioned within the authentic documentary that grew to become the pilot episode. Regardless of how tough it may be to outlive in nature, you known as the expertise “soul-filling” to be so far-off from the “trappings of society.” So then the place do you sq. the VR sport with the soul-filling expertise? Do you continue to suppose that ‘soul-filling’ high quality is part of Survivorman VR: The Descent?
Stroud:
It’s an important query as a result of it might be very easy simply to maintain it hardcore. You already know, it’s nearly survival abilities. And in reality, it was Andrew who – I imply, I pity the blokes, Andrew and the group as a result of I don’t know what number of episodes of Survivorman they’ve needed to watch or how typically they’ve needed to watch the identical episode to see the sorts of issues I do to convey that into the VR.
However by the identical token, they picked up on the truth that I do precisely what you’re speaking about. So sure, that’s truly a part of the expertise. There’s a second in there, the place I come to the sting of the mountain and we glance out throughout the mountain, and that’s what we discuss. How stunning it’s.
So sure, we undoubtedly squared that up, and it wasn’t even my concept, that was simply Andrew who mentioned ‘Hey, I used to be fascinated by doing this, what do you suppose?’ and I mentioned ‘Nicely I wouldn’t have even thought that we might have wished to place that in there.’ Whilst a lot as I’d have wished to place it in, and I’m so glad they did. And we’ll proceed with that, completely.
Since you’re proper, it’s fulfilling to be out in nature like that. I wrote a kids’s ebook known as Wild Exterior, it was directed in direction of 7-12’s, it was simply to get them again out in nature once more, me giving them concepts and issues they will do, and it may be within the yard.
And that has at all times been my mission, with Survivorman, and even the VR, it’s actually what I’m doing is facilitating abilities. A talent set which may simply make you a bit extra snug the subsequent time you go on a hike in Algonquin Park, the subsequent time you go on a path in your neighborhood.
So yea, that’s undoubtedly a part of it. I imply, the abilities are simply that, there abilities they usually’re enjoyable. However ultimately, you understand ‘Oh, I do know what to do now, on this scenario.,’ due to Survivorman and Survivorman VR, which I feel is fairly cool.
Earlier than you go on to your subsequent query I simply need to make it identified, I’m additionally thrilled at this, you realize I cherry decide what to do with my profession lately, and I’m doing an terrible lot of music, scored movies, scored all my very own theme songs for my reveals and I’m at all times performing and I’m releasing three albums this yr beginning February 16, 2024.
So I used to be thrilled after I realized – and we didn’t even give it some thought till midway by – that ‘Why am I not scoring the music for this?’ So I don’t do all of the music on the VR, however I’ve carried out a bunch of that and the subsequent one round I’ll simply do all of the music. In order that’s one other thrill.
I convey all of my very own creative intent into this by having the ability to usher in my music, it’s enjoyable.
PSU: Are you able to give me an instance of one thing you bought them so as to add to the sport that wouldn’t have made it in in any other case?
Stroud:
Oh yeah, it’s type of limitless, as a result of, and to their credit score, they have been doing the most effective they may however they haven’t gone out and truly carried out these items. Even if you happen to watched my stuff from tv, it’s onerous to get it. So I labored rather a lot with Andrew on get a fireplace going utilizing charred fabric.
We have been forwards and backwards and forwards and backwards and ‘No, it wouldn’t be a flame Andrew, it might be an ember, it’s not a flame at this stage it’s simply an ember’ after which Andrew would come again and I’d say ‘That’s a large quantity of embers, it might solely be a tiny one.’
So we’d be going forwards and backwards on the superb particulars. That’s me geeking out now on do charred fabric. Similar factor occurred with snaring a rabbit to get some meals. So how do you snare a Snowshoe Hare? And once more, they watched the present and all the pieces, and it’s not proper.
So I’m like ‘Nicely we are able to do it within the Arctic, but it surely’s difficult. So we now have to do it a special approach then you definitely’re doing it. The best way you’re doing it’s as if it have been in a forest, however we’re not in a forest we’re within the Arctic tundra, so it’s a must to design it this manner.’
To their credit score, motor abilities and hand manipulation in VR is difficult, that’s actually tough to point out. So I’ve to compromise. We have now a factor the place there’s an element once you repel off a cliff, and I used to be like ‘Nicely that is simply all incorrect,’ you realize?
And the opposite factor we do in areas the place there are higher consultants than I, like, positive, you need survival? Don’t look previous me. Nevertheless in relation to mountain climbing, I imply I’ve carried out just a little bit, I received a couple of abilities and stuff. I feel I received them involved with Will Gaddd, an knowledgeable in mountain climbing to ensure, ‘wouldn’t it be a prusik loop? Which carabiner can be used, how tight would that be?’
However then we are able to’t present these superb motor abilities, so right here comes suspension of disbelief, you simply contact on it and it’s tied. And with making snowshoes, you may make a snow shoe the way in which we present it within the sport, however by the identical token we are able to’t present these motor abilities, so it must be what it’s.
However it’s getting higher and higher and we’re in a position to present increasingly more on a regular basis.
PSU: So do you suppose that at some point Survivorman VR may very well be the most effective real looking survival simulation expertise?
Stroud:
It already is.
I’ll inform you the reality although, you made me consider one thing. I don’t know what’s on the market, and I don’t care. After I make tv, I don’t know what the opposite networks are displaying. I don’t care, I make what I make. I do what I do, and I do it to the most effective of my skill and I would like it to be at a excessive commonplace, a top quality bar.
So you realize I don’t know what else is on the market, I don’t know what we’re up towards as a result of I’m not up towards something. You already know after I did Survivorman after which different reveals got here alongside and have been copying and doing sure issues, and you realize individuals say ‘Nicely why don’t you do that’ I don’t care what they’re doing.
I don’t even want to look at them, as a result of I do what I do. Our new sequence Wild Harvest on PBS, we have been the primary on air with a foraging present, and now they’re in all places. So I get one other little declare, however the actuality is that we have been the primary foraging present on tv and I don’t take a look at what any of the opposite reveals are doing.
As a result of I do need to do what I do, from my stage, my commonplace, keep the place I’m at and be an artist about it as a lot as potential.
PSU: That brings me to a different query I had, do you play any survival video games, have you ever tried anything that’s on the market?
Stroud:
So I’m gonna break everybody’s hearts, I’m not a gamer. I used to be a gamer with my son, with Name Of Responsibility 24/7, however after we each drifted away from that I haven’t been a gamer since. So I really feel like I’ve to be just a little apologetic to the gamer group that I’m not a gamer, however I get it.
I used to be a Name Of Responsibility addict for some time, and different video games as properly. However I personally, I’m too busy writing songs and mountaineering within the woods.
PSU: I get that, can’t precisely take the controller with you on these hikes. You say you’re taking your harmonica with you in all places in Survivorman, is your harmonica in Survivorman VR: The Descent?
Stroud:
Brief reply: sure.
PSU: Nice.
Stroud:
And, there’s an Easter Egg in there as properly, if you happen to occur to be searching for an enormous, furry strolling creature within the woods, that is likely to be an Easter Egg. But it surely’s not apparent.
PSU: A big-footed creature?
Stroud:
Precisely, some type of creature with huge ft, that is likely to be one in every of our Easter Eggs. I imply Easter Eggs are clearly type of a factor lately, however they’re enjoyable, I like them.
PSU: Nicely I’m glad to have that confirmed. What would you want individuals to remove from this sport? Do you suppose it might be nice if somebody performed this after which had the urge to go tenting?
Stroud:
I do, and that’s why I choose to name it a simulation. Since you’re not chilly, you’re not moist, you’re in your home, you’re not even drained. However but you’re attempting to mentally determine all this stuff out, get it proper and do that. And I feel it simply naturally makes the connection.
It will be onerous to achieve a half a dozen abilities or extra from taking part in one thing like this and never bear in mind them once you’re exterior. That connection will certainly occur. Clearly that doesn’t occur with all the pieces in Survivorman VR, however for lots of it, it does.
I’m not even sure articulate why or the way it occurs, however simply affiliation, I suppose.
It’s actually great, to really create one thing that results individuals personally, extra than simply leisure. I like entertaining, don’t get me incorrect, however that further layer, that further stage is essential, and I like that.
PSU: Whereas the actual factor may by no means examine to the expertise in Survivorman VR, and you may’t precisely get individuals within the mindset that one thing is ‘dwell or die,’ do you suppose Survivorman VR is ready to obtain placing gamers in these tense conditions and mindsets?
Stroud:
Nicely yeah, numerous that comes all the way down to the great design of Andrew and the group. You may die on this sport rather a lot, and also you don’t die by surviving appropriately, you die by not surviving, by not doing the best issues.
We’ve received movie footage of individuals taking part in it, saying ‘Oh I’m getting too chilly, I’m getting too chilly!’ once they’re sitting in a chair inside. However they will really feel that pressure. With the watch that we now have, I neglect the title of it however there’s a watch that you simply put on, and it’s displaying you your stage of fireside, and that it’s going out.
So that you don’t simply get a fireplace going and stroll away, that fireplace goes to exit if you happen to don’t take note of it. All this stuff occur in a succession that’s precise, within the area, and since they occur in that succession it’s a must to take note of them. So yeah, there’s a pressure and an pleasure, to the entire sport when you’re taking part in it, to the entire simulation I ought to say.
That I feel was actually type of the purpose, and Andrew and the group have been actually good at bringing in some issues that I wouldn’t know convey them into the gameplay, however they do. You may’t really feel that you simply’re getting chilly, however your watch goes to inform you that you simply’re getting chilly.
Whenever you die, you begin to see this haze that takes over your eyes, and it’s like crystals and stuff coming in since you’re dying of hypothermia, you’re freezing to dying. So sure is the quick reply.
PSU: Mr. Stroud, I can’t thanks sufficient on your time as we speak, it’s been a pleasure and a privilege getting to speak to you about Survivoman and Survivorman VR: The Descent.
Survivorman VR: The Descent is now accessible on PS5 and PS VR2, you possibly can try our evaluate right here.